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Procedure for creating recording list in HumaxRW?

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    ergolargo

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    Greetings!

    Could anybody help me out? Having suffered the old disappearing recording list trick once more on my 9200
    t, I thought this time I might not take it lying down, and have a go at rescuing the recordings using the HumaxRW utility.

    I managed to locate the FAQ posting here
    https://myhumax.org/forum/topic/humaxrw
    with the download links.

    I have a USB/IDE adapter to hand, and this is my general understanding of the process:

    1. Extract disk from Humax.
    2. Copy ts and hre files from the Humax disk as it currently is, onto an external USB drive.
    3. Regenerate the recording list 'table of contents' from this copied data.
    4. Return disk to Humax in order to format it.
    5. Extract disk from Humax again in order to copy ts, hre and new table of contents onto the newly formatted disk.
    6. Return disk to Humax and experience great joy at successful completion of procedure.

    It is stage 3 that I have queries about: recreating the table of contents, i.e., the list of programs that I would expect to see in 'Recorded Programmes'. I have a strong suspicion that this step is not as straightforward as I am hoping.

    As far as I understand it, the list of programmes is normally created by the Humax box by assembling together all the individual hre files, one for each recording. The list of programmes is lost when a 'table of contents' file is corrupted upon a hardware crash (perhaps being 'locked open', as in some Windows problems?)

    My first question: is HumaxRW actually able to regenerate this alleged table of contents file automatically, by polling all the hre files in turn, or is it a process that has to be done manually?

    Another issue is, will a newly created 'recordings list' still feature the correct titles, and the dates and times of the original recordings, or will they just be labelled with automatically generated names, and given the current date and time? If it is this second 'worst case' scenario, then it might make it more trouble than it is worth, if all the salvaged recordings are in a random order?

    Finally, is there a definitive documented version of the process I outline in the steps above, as I am currently just guessing, and assume that I will now need to work through any documentation that is available. If anybody could be so kind as to point me in the right direction to a tried and tested procedure, that would be immensely helpful.

    If I am making any incorrect assumptions in the scribblings above, please could you also point out where I would be going wrong?

    Thanks very much for any assistance offered.

    Regards

    | Mon 14 Nov 2016 20:18:15 #1 |
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    Martin Liddle

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    ergolargo - 1 hour ago  » 
    3. Regenerate the recording list 'table of contents' from this copied data.

    What makes you think that step is possible?

    | Mon 14 Nov 2016 21:35:34 #2 |
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    ergolargo

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    Hello!

    My step '3' is indeed a bit of a black box, and that is why I am needing to seek advice. I just got the impression that HumaxRW offered a 'recovery mode' route to avoid having to do a reformat in these situations, but please feel free to clarify if this is incorrect.

    Isn't correcting the missing list the whole point of extracting the recorded content of the disk after the recorded programs list goes missing? In the past, I've seen plenty of posts to imply that when the list goes missing (which apparently is a common problem after a Humax box crashes while deleting recordings from the list, as it did in my case), then there is a way to avoid having to reformat by using HumaxRW to fix the logical damage, and get the recorded programs to be listed again. This would suggest that there is a route to automatically recreating the list, or at least to manually repair the damage in some way. If there is simply no way to do what I would need to do, I'll happily give in, and, like I have plenty of times before, just reformat.

    Are the newer models of Humax just as flaky when it comes to managing the recordings?

    Cheers

    | Tue 15 Nov 2016 13:19:01 #3 |
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    Martin Liddle

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    ergolargo - 1 hour ago  » 
    My step '3' is indeed a bit of a black box, and that is why I am needing to seek advice. I just got the impression that HumaxRW offered a 'recovery mode' route to avoid having to do a reformat in these situations, but please feel free to clarify if this is incorrect.

    the help for recovery mode says:

    "Recovery mode - use if record list is missing/corrupt
    =============
    Usage: humaxrw -r [options] HUMAXDISK

    -i <list> get info for recordings
    -l list recordings
    -n no info - use if corruption is really bad
    -g <list> get recordings to current directory as recover_nnnn.ts

    Example of a list: 10-20,30,41-42"

    Nothing I can see about rebuilding the list.

    Isn't correcting the missing list the whole point of extracting the recorded content of the disk after the recorded programs list goes missing?

    It would be good if it did but i don't believe that it does.

    In the past, I've seen plenty of posts to imply that when the list goes missing (which apparently is a common problem after a Humax box crashes while deleting recordings from the list, as it did in my case), then there is a way to avoid having to reformat by using HumaxRW to fix the logical damage, and get the recorded programs to be listed again.

    Could you provide a link to such a post please? By the way I don't think a crash is the only way for the file system to become corrupt; it is more common for the corruption to gradually develop before the list of programs is lost, most commonly when coming out of standby.

    This would suggest that there is a route to automatically recreating the list, or at least to manually repair the damage in some way. If there is simply no way to do what I would need to do, I'll happily give in, and, like I have plenty of times before, just reformat.

    The normal way to do this is copy off the recordings, format, copy them back.

    Are the newer models of Humax just as flaky when it comes to managing the recordings?

    They are more robust because they use standard Linux file systems. However because the hard drives in PVRs don't do as much error correction as standard drives then I suspect the risk of corruption is still a bit higher than on a normal computer.

    | Tue 15 Nov 2016 14:30:49 #4 |
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    ergolargo

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    Thanks for that

    Can I ask though, when you say:
    "The normal way to do this is copy off the recordings, format, copy them back."
    ... what do the recordings look like when they get back on the disk? Is this process alone enough to trigger the recorded list to be rebuilt by the machine? In other words, if the recorded list is gone before the format, is there then nothing that can be done to get the list to reappear?

    Those recovery mode options you mention - it was those I was interpreting as providing a means to create a list - if that's not what they do, I am a bit unsure as to what recovery mode would actually be used for!? Maybe it can be used to generate a cleartext file of a list for crossreferencing with unlabelled recordings? But if there is still no list of items to be selected upon returning the files to a newly formatted disk, I'm not sure I understand the point of the recovery mode options!

    Also, as an aside would you happen to know the standard size of the hard drive inside a PVR 9200T?

    Thanks if you can help with these questions.

    Regards

    | Tue 15 Nov 2016 16:30:04 #5 |
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    Martin Liddle

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    ergolargo - 1 hour ago  » 
    "The normal way to do this is copy off the recordings, format, copy them back."
    ... what do the recordings look like when they get back on the disk? Is this process alone enough to trigger the recorded list to be rebuilt by the machine?

    It is too long since I did it to remember exactly but I think the full titles are gone and it is just the file name but they can of course be edited.

    In other words, if the recorded list is gone before the format, is there then nothing that can be done to get the list to reappear?

    It seems to me it might be possible to write software to do it but I don't think anything currently exists. xyz321 is the expert on this and as he has contributed to the thread he might give a definitive view.

    Those recovery mode options you mention - it was those I was interpreting as providing a means to create a list - if that's not what they do, I am a bit unsure as to what recovery mode would actually be used for!?

    Without recovery mode you have no way of accessing the program files once the list of programs is lost.

    But if there is still no list of items to be selected upon returning the files to a newly formatted disk, I'm not sure I understand the point of the recovery mode options!

    There is a list of items when you copy back.

    Also, as an aside would you happen to know the standard size of the hard drive inside a PVR 9200T?

    160 GB. The 9200T will support larger disks but there is a limit of 512 on the number of recordings so a drive bigger than about 500GB is of limited use.

    | Tue 15 Nov 2016 17:57:04 #6 |
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    ergolargo

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    Thanks very much for all that useful info

    I'm still trying to decide whether it is worth undertaking this 'salvage operation', but I appreciate that the remaining questions I have might be getting a bit exact, and I might just have to try it and see. But if you did have any further light to shine on such matter, I am wondering if:

    1) Do the restored recordings have their original date and time of recording still displayed, or do all the restored recordings just all get stamped with the same date?

    2) Is there any way of editing the names of the restored files as they appear in the newly created recorded list BEFORE the disk is returned into the Humax box, or are they stored in a proprietary file only accessed from within the Humax on-screen 'remote control' interface. Editing all those filenames that way would, I fear, just be too much of a time-consuming and soul-destroying experience!

    3) Is there any evidence that the file corruptions I have been periodically suffering are more likely to be triggered when the disk gets more than 75% full? To reduce such a likelihood, I am considering the feasibility of an upgrade to the actual hard disk inside the box. Presumably the drive inside is just a standard old-school IDE hard drive, which as you have already implied could be replaced with a larger drive, if I can still find one anywhere; but are there any particular 'gotcha' traps that I should be aware of before attempting such an upgrade, i.e., any specific issues with drive speed etc that are known to cause compatibility problems?

    Thanks if you can sort me out with any additional info about these.

    Many regards

    | Wed 16 Nov 2016 10:51:05 #7 |
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    Martin Liddle

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    ergolargo - 1 hour ago  » 
    1) Do the restored recordings have their original date and time of recording still displayed, or do all the restored recordings just all get stamped with the same date?

    Sorry I can't remember.

    2) Is there any way of editing the names of the restored files as they appear in the newly created recorded list BEFORE the disk is returned into the Humax box, or are they stored in a proprietary file only accessed from within the Humax on-screen 'remote control' interface.

    I don't know of a way to do it other than via the Humax interface; it is certainly feasible to do it but nobody has written the software.

    3) Is there any evidence that the file corruptions I have been periodically suffering are more likely to be triggered when the disk gets more than 75% full?

    All sorts of theories have been put forward for why the file system gets corrupted but I don't think anyone has done a proper study.

    To reduce such a likelihood, I am considering the feasibility of an upgrade to the actual hard disk inside the box. Presumably the drive inside is just a standard old-school IDE hard drive, which as you have already implied could be replaced with a larger drive, if I can still find one anywhere; but are there any particular 'gotcha' traps that I should be aware of before attempting such an upgrade, i.e., any specific issues with drive speed etc that are known to cause compatibility problems?

    There are compatibility issues with some models of hard drive; I tried a Western Digital AV IDE drive that would not reliably come out of standby. It is a matter of suck it and see. It is possible to use a SATA drive and an IDE to SATA converter. However when you can buy a refurbished HDR-1800T (320GB disk) with a years warranty for £79 I wouldn't bother with trying to upgrade a 9200T..

    | Wed 16 Nov 2016 12:39:05 #8 |
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    ergolargo

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    OK thanks for that.

    I think I will have a go at doing this salvage, just to see how close I can get. I am still a bit confused about the usage of the 'ts2hrw' utility. Does it have a specific use that is relevant to my scenario, and if so, is there a download available on this forum anywhere?

    Cheers

    | Wed 16 Nov 2016 14:24:29 #9 |
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    Martin Liddle

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    ergolargo - 11 minutes ago  » 
    I am still a bit confused about the usage of the 'ts2hrw' utility. Does it have a specific use that is relevant to my scenario, and if so, is there a download available on this forum anywhere?

    I had forgotten that bit. In recovery mode the .hre file is not copied to the PC (because it is assumed to be corrupt). The ts2hrw is used to recreate them on the PC before copying back. ts2hrw.exe should be in the humaxrw zip file and there is also a README.txt file which answers many of the questions you have asked.

    | Wed 16 Nov 2016 14:40:20 #10 |

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